"No Andrei, no exchange." Coordinator of Polish special services revealed details of Pochobut's exchange

Tomasz Siemoniak, Minister-Coordinator of Polish Special Services, spoke on TVPinfo about how the exchange took place on the Polish-Belarusian border, which resulted in the release of Andrei Pochobut on Tuesday, writes REFORM.news.

According to Siemoniak, the Polish side was not confident in the success of the operation until the very end.

"This exchange was very probable, as not only Poland and Belarus were involved. However, in such situations, you can never be sure that something won't happen, that the President of Belarus won't call and say that we won't do this, because that's exactly what happened last time when we were very close to an exchange," he said.

Siemoniak added that the agreement on the technical details of the exchange lasted several days. Individuals from third countries had to be brought to the border. Their participation in the exchange gave the Polish side more confidence.

"A minute before 13:00, when it was supposed to start, the Prime Minister and I were looking at a screen showing where the Belarusians with Andrei Pochobut should appear from, and we were not confident. The emotions at that moment were very strong. It was really happening. There was the other side, which kept its word yesterday, but had broken it several times before," he added.

Siemoniak stated that the Polish side set a condition: Andrei Pochobut must cross the border first.

"Yes, that was our condition, accepted by the other side, so for us, it was clear. No Andrei Pochobut, no exchange," he said.

According to him, he expected Pochobut to ask about returning to Belarus. Siemoniak noted that the political prisoner is "a great Polish, and also Belarusian, hero of the struggle for democracy, the struggle for minority rights," who does not want to be an outlaw.

The Minister recalled that there had been cases in the past when people, during exchanges, refused and returned to the country that had handed them over. Such a case occurred during the times of the Polish People's Republic.

"Therefore, nothing was clear here, and it was obvious and natural for me that he wanted to make it clear: I care about Belarus, the rule of law in Belarus, and that he is not an exile from his country, like dozens or hundreds of other Belarusian oppositionists," Siemoniak said.

"This is his decision. He received the best medical care here. Yesterday evening he met with his family. He needs to undergo examinations. However, he is a free man, and he will make that decision himself. Of course, we will do everything possible to provide him with the best conditions here, but, as I said, he is a free man and will do whatever he wants," he added, answering a question about Andrei Pochobut's possible decision.

The Minister noted that Pochobut's release is an important moment in Polish-Belarusian relations. And now it depends on Alexander Lukashenka what the next steps will be and the context of his negotiations with US President's special envoy, John Koel.

Siemoniak stressed that although Pochobut is the most well-known of those released, the return of other participants in the exchange was also important.

"However, the one who is imprisoned in Belarus on charges of espionage for Poland – we worked very intensively on this, and we were also very worried about him. We do not abandon anyone who worked for Poland, or those who, like Father Havel, were accused of this. Although the evidence here was very poor. We are looking for every Pole who, in our opinion, is imprisoned unjustly and politically, either on false charges of espionage or other charges," he said.

Answering a question about the factors for the operation's success, the Minister noted that the three individuals handed over by Poland were of great importance to the other side.

"Certainly, the fact that the three people we are extraditing are of enormous significance and important to the other side. Certainly, American intervention and American-Belarusian relations. And, of course, the fact that Russia, which often pulls the strings in the case of Belarus, was also very interested in carrying out this exchange. These factors undoubtedly determined yesterday's success," he said.

Siemoniak added that Lukashenka found himself in a situation where he had to reckon with Russia, with the Americans, and this narrowed his possibilities for disrupting the deal at the last minute because "someone in Poland said something."

The program host also asked the Minister if Poland intended to start an investigation into Pochobut's torture.

"I believe that we must take all necessary legal actions in such a case. It is difficult for me to speak on behalf of the prosecutor's office or assess the situation here. I can say one thing for sure, because I was there, I spoke with Andrei Pochobut. We hugged. I knew him from media reports and saw what a strong man he was, cheerful, energetic, and so on. I hugged a man who, after five years, was simply starved, exhausted, and weak, so he did not have the conditions that should have been in prison. Even when a person is imprisoned, certain rules apply regarding medical care, nutrition, and treatment [...] And this must also be part of the assessment by the prosecutor's office and the Polish authorities as to how he was treated there," he replied.

Siemoniak also commented on the prospects for improving relations with Minsk.

"It's difficult to say. We are interested in keeping these relations as less tense as possible. The opening of some border crossings last year… However, Polish experience shows that these relations are like a sinusoid: better, worse, and more often worse.

After 2020, after the failed presidential elections in Belarus, we faced very negative phenomena, including hybrid aggression at the border.

It should be noted that for several weeks there have been no attempts of illegal border crossing from the Belarusian side, which was our years-long nightmare, starting from 2021. Therefore, Poland is certainly interested in normal relations, in not seeking various tensions, and so on. However, to what extent is Lukashenka independent of Russia, and to what extent can Lukashenka afford such a policy? These are separate questions. We are monitoring what is happening between the United States and Belarus, and I am confident – we discuss this daily – it is also important that Belarus is not some state 100% dependent on Russia," Siemoniak said.

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